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	<title>Comments on: PureMVC: First thoughts &#38; FlashDevelop templates</title>
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	<pubDate>Sun, 05 Feb 2012 18:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: devdave</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-378</link>
		<dc:creator>devdave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Feb 2010 08:16:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-378</guid>
		<description>For a long time this is exactly what I did; I had my own framework developed over a number of years which worked very well and certainly required less code than PureMVC.  However every now and again something would come up in a project which required me to fight with the framework to get something done and I'd end up extending the framework to cope with it.  Finally I had myself a great framework to code on - and you know what?  It wasn't that different from PureMVC :)

Its true that PureMVC applications do have a lot of supporting code, but I never actually have to write any of these by hand; I have templates for Mediators, Proxies and Commands (FlashDevelop versions available from this site), macros for common lines of code (e.g. var somethingProxy:SomethingProxy = facade.retrieveProxy(SomethingProxy.NAME) as SomethingProxy) and a PureMVC plugin to add and remove notification listeners to Mediators.

Its true that handovers can have lots of lines of code, but I argue as to whether or not this a problem.  As a developer on an existing project I would far prefer to receive a larger codebase based around PureMVC conventions in which I instantly know where everything is and how it communicates internally, instead of having to learn someone's custom framework anew each time.  Since a good chunk of the codebase is instantly recognisable as PureMVC scaffolding I just disregard that and can go straight to the important bits.

Personally I would say the best thing about PureMVC is that it gives developers a common framework to use and (theoretically, as you say :) ) they should be able to pick up a project a lot easier than if a custom framework has been used.

I'd say the size of the codebase is irrelevant; to me the worst thing about PureMVC is that it can encourage developers to just 'follow the PureMVC way' and not really think about the patterns or what they are doing.  PureMVC should lay the foundations and you can then engineer your project on top of that in the best way for the app.

This is an interesting article; I don't necessarily agree with it all but there are some good points there - http://www.simple-talk.com/community/blogs/alex/archive/2009/03/19/72519.aspx

Dave</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For a long time this is exactly what I did; I had my own framework developed over a number of years which worked very well and certainly required less code than PureMVC.  However every now and again something would come up in a project which required me to fight with the framework to get something done and I&#8217;d end up extending the framework to cope with it.  Finally I had myself a great framework to code on - and you know what?  It wasn&#8217;t that different from PureMVC <img src='http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Its true that PureMVC applications do have a lot of supporting code, but I never actually have to write any of these by hand; I have templates for Mediators, Proxies and Commands (FlashDevelop versions available from this site), macros for common lines of code (e.g. var somethingProxy:SomethingProxy = facade.retrieveProxy(SomethingProxy.NAME) as SomethingProxy) and a PureMVC plugin to add and remove notification listeners to Mediators.</p>
<p>Its true that handovers can have lots of lines of code, but I argue as to whether or not this a problem.  As a developer on an existing project I would far prefer to receive a larger codebase based around PureMVC conventions in which I instantly know where everything is and how it communicates internally, instead of having to learn someone&#8217;s custom framework anew each time.  Since a good chunk of the codebase is instantly recognisable as PureMVC scaffolding I just disregard that and can go straight to the important bits.</p>
<p>Personally I would say the best thing about PureMVC is that it gives developers a common framework to use and (theoretically, as you say <img src='http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> ) they should be able to pick up a project a lot easier than if a custom framework has been used.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d say the size of the codebase is irrelevant; to me the worst thing about PureMVC is that it can encourage developers to just &#8216;follow the PureMVC way&#8217; and not really think about the patterns or what they are doing.  PureMVC should lay the foundations and you can then engineer your project on top of that in the best way for the app.</p>
<p>This is an interesting article; I don&#8217;t necessarily agree with it all but there are some good points there - <a href="http://www.simple-talk.com/community/blogs/alex/archive/2009/03/19/72519.aspx" rel="nofollow">http://www.simple-talk.com/community/blogs/alex/archive/2009/03/19/72519.aspx</a></p>
<p>Dave</p>
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		<title>By: one giant media</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-374</link>
		<dc:creator>one giant media</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 19:07:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-374</guid>
		<description>The best part about something like PureMVC is that you can send new developers to learn it and when they come back they'll know how to navigate and maintain the codebase (theoretically).

The worst part about PureMVC is how much overkill design patternage is there, if you're not worried about hand offs with a huge codebase (ie 8000+ lines) to other developers I would write my own framework and keep it fitted to the app's needs... It's pretty easy to set up models, controllers, views, and create custom event classes, etc with loose coupling.  Doing this might take a week to get it right at first, but in the end your codebase will probably be about 1/2 of PureMVC route.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The best part about something like PureMVC is that you can send new developers to learn it and when they come back they&#8217;ll know how to navigate and maintain the codebase (theoretically).</p>
<p>The worst part about PureMVC is how much overkill design patternage is there, if you&#8217;re not worried about hand offs with a huge codebase (ie 8000+ lines) to other developers I would write my own framework and keep it fitted to the app&#8217;s needs&#8230; It&#8217;s pretty easy to set up models, controllers, views, and create custom event classes, etc with loose coupling.  Doing this might take a week to get it right at first, but in the end your codebase will probably be about 1/2 of PureMVC route.</p>
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		<title>By: Papervision3D, FlashDevelop template &#124; thumbleaf</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-357</link>
		<dc:creator>Papervision3D, FlashDevelop template &#124; thumbleaf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Nov 2009 21:37:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-357</guid>
		<description>[...] a good set of templates can be found over at http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/   var addthis_pub = ''; var addthis_language = 'en';var addthis_options = 'email, favorites, digg, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a good set of templates can be found over at <a href="http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/" rel="nofollow">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/</a>   var addthis_pub = &#8221;; var addthis_language = &#8216;en&#8217;;var addthis_options = &#8216;email, favorites, digg, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Carl</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-312</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 02:23:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-312</guid>
		<description>Sure. All I meant to say was that since there is no official implementation - PureMVC (apart from being called such) is as good (or bad) as any other implementation.

I do, however, question the criticism that design patterns must be implemented. Apart from use-value being only one value, software designers can get a lot of use-value from a design pattern - without actually doing any implementation. The designer will delegate the implementation to an implementor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure. All I meant to say was that since there is no official implementation - PureMVC (apart from being called such) is as good (or bad) as any other implementation.</p>
<p>I do, however, question the criticism that design patterns must be implemented. Apart from use-value being only one value, software designers can get a lot of use-value from a design pattern - without actually doing any implementation. The designer will delegate the implementation to an implementor.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: devdave</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-311</link>
		<dc:creator>devdave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 02:11:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-311</guid>
		<description>Well that's ok because PureMVC never claimed to be a design pattern - it is a development framework that happens to implement a bunch of design patterns in its structure.  Design patterns, whilst abstract, have to be implemented at some level other no-one would ever be able to use them for anything...

Dave</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well that&#8217;s ok because PureMVC never claimed to be a design pattern - it is a development framework that happens to implement a bunch of design patterns in its structure.  Design patterns, whilst abstract, have to be implemented at some level other no-one would ever be able to use them for anything&#8230;</p>
<p>Dave</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Carl</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-310</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 01:59:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-310</guid>
		<description>Any implementation of a design pattern is not itself a design pattern. A design pattern is deliberatly de-coupled from any "official" specification of an implementation. The first problem with "pureMVC" is calling it "pureMVC". I don't know if there is a second problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any implementation of a design pattern is not itself a design pattern. A design pattern is deliberatly de-coupled from any &#8220;official&#8221; specification of an implementation. The first problem with &#8220;pureMVC&#8221; is calling it &#8220;pureMVC&#8221;. I don&#8217;t know if there is a second problem.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: devdave</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-307</link>
		<dc:creator>devdave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 01:28:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-307</guid>
		<description>Hi Patrik,

You are 100% correct, and all I can do is apologise and hide my head in shame ;)  Coupling and cohesion both begin with the same two letters, its an easy mistake to make...

Anyway, apologies to anyone who has been carrying around a skewed view of OOP thanks to this article and I have now corrected this.

Dave</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Patrik,</p>
<p>You are 100% correct, and all I can do is apologise and hide my head in shame <img src='http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  Coupling and cohesion both begin with the same two letters, its an easy mistake to make&#8230;</p>
<p>Anyway, apologies to anyone who has been carrying around a skewed view of OOP thanks to this article and I have now corrected this.</p>
<p>Dave</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Patrik</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-296</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Aug 2009 12:59:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-296</guid>
		<description>Hi,
I just started to read about PureMVC and I found your page. I don't understand why you are looking for low cohesion in your mvc frameworks? The traditional way is to aim for high cohesion and low coupling? Or do you mean that PureMVC is lacking high cohesion?
Best regards,
Patrik</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,<br />
I just started to read about PureMVC and I found your page. I don&#8217;t understand why you are looking for low cohesion in your mvc frameworks? The traditional way is to aim for high cohesion and low coupling? Or do you mean that PureMVC is lacking high cohesion?<br />
Best regards,<br />
Patrik</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Thrust Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Feels like the first time……PureMVC</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-295</link>
		<dc:creator>Thrust Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Feels like the first time……PureMVC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Aug 2009 20:03:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-295</guid>
		<description>[...] I could use in FDT for PureMVC.  I didn’t find any for FDT, but I did find some for FlashDevelop here.  I tooks those templates and retro fitted them to work in FDT.  You can snag the templates if [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I could use in FDT for PureMVC.  I didn’t find any for FDT, but I did find some for FlashDevelop here.  I tooks those templates and retro fitted them to work in FDT.  You can snag the templates if [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: away4m</title>
		<link>http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-293</link>
		<dc:creator>away4m</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:00:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.actionscriptdeveloper.co.uk/puremvc-first-thoughts-flashdevelop-templates/#comment-293</guid>
		<description>easy way to access flashdevelop templates folder that in flashdevelop ide  Tools &#62; Application Files.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>easy way to access flashdevelop templates folder that in flashdevelop ide  Tools &gt; Application Files.</p>
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